Reliance MF - Stock is better than the fu
Printed From: The Equity Desk
Category: Investment Ideas - Creating winning portfolios!
Forum Name: Large Cap Blue Chips
Forum Discription: You would not need to read any note, brokerage reports or wait for FII recommendation to buy these stocks. These are solid companies with established business & are akin to family silver.
URL: http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=981
Printed Date: 07/May/2025 at 4:31pm
Topic: Reliance MF - Stock is better than the fu
Posted By: basant
Subject: Reliance MF - Stock is better than the fu
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 6:32pm
|
Reliance MF currently manages around US $ 15 billion. This is about of There are other options as well. http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=431 - Sundaram Finance being one of them unfortunately it is a leader in nothing and we all know that the bigger gains are made in leader companies. http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=946 - Kotak bank is an interesting AMC play but their MF business isn’t doing as great as one would think. ICICI Pru can be bought through http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=277 - http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=940 - investing more into the markets this AMC business would explode.
“Fidelity isn’t a public company so you couldn’t invest in the rush here. But what about Dreyfus? Want to see a chart that doesn’t stop? The stock sold for 40 cents a share in 1977 then nearly US $ 40 a share in 1986, a 100 bagger in 9 years and much of that during a lousy stock market. Franklin was a 138 bagger and Federated was up fifty fold before it was bought away by Aetna. I was right on top of all of them. I knew the Dreyfus story, the Franklin story, the Federated story from beginning to end Everything was right, earnings were up, the momentum was obvious . How much did I make from all this? Zippo. I did not buy a single share of any financial services companies nor Dreyfus nor Federated nor Franklin. I missed the whole idea and did not realize it until it was too late. I guess I was too busy thinking of the Union oil of California – like the doctors. Reliance Capital has already been a 20 bagger in this market. Can it go up 5 fold from here? The international comparisons do not seem discouraging at all. ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Replies:
Posted By: smartcat
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 6:51pm
|
What about JM Financial? Does JM's AMC business come under this?
If Reliance Capital was just a plain vanilla listed AMC, I would NOT have invested in it. My logic -
- More Indians are investing in MFs. That's wonderful. But more Indians are buying cars, trading in shares etc. That alone wouldn't make automobile/brokerage company shares a good buy - there are other factors involved in making an investment decision.
- AMCs typically charge 2% of equity AUM and 0.25 - 0.5% of debt AUM as as management fees. So revenues of a AMC is directly proportional to returns of all the different equity/debt funds.
- For example, let's take Reliance MF - one of the best MF houses. It has good performers like Vision/Growth fund but along with that, it has laggards like Reliance Equity Fund (the Rs. 5,000 crore fund). The average returns of all the funds in Reliance MF will probably be equal to benchmark Sensex/Nifty returns.
- So basically, the earnings of a pure AMC company won't deviate much from that of Sensex/Nifty. So rather than buying the stock of AMC, I would rather put in an index fund.
|
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 6:54pm
|
But the corpus is increasing. That means additional money at no cost. Let's check JM!!! ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: johnnybravo
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 8:06pm
I would slightly disagree on these two points - buying car/house is a one time process, but investing is a continuous process - you keep on investing as you earn more and with income levels in India rising there is fair chance that the quantum of investments that people do shall also increase. Say I do a SIP on Rs 100/- every month this year, with my salary rising I shall do a SIP of Rs. 125/- the next year -- You see the quantum of investments is also increasing... Secondly, agreed that there are some good and more bad funds in given AMC, but people still go by fund house rather than going by the fund theme and fund manager....the craze and demands for NFO's shall be there for some more time. Once they learn the art of investing in the better funds, fund houses shall also evolve and become wiser. So eventually the performing funds shall attract investments. So a wiser investor (TED'ies) shall choose Reliance Growth over Reliance Equity. Finally who benefits? Reliance AMC. |
Posted By: smartcat
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 9:37pm
|
There are basically two arguments against 'Investing in AMC' idea -
- Investor indifference to performance (NFO mania)
- Oversaturation of the market (competition)
Tushar - you have tried to take out the first argument by saying that, eventually, Indian investors will get smarter, reward performance and punish non-performers. Allright maybe. I will look forward to the day when UTI, Principal, ICICI etc drop out of the top 10 list.
But if more money flows into MFs, you will see more fund houses launching their wares in India. In the past 5 months alone, we've had 3 new fund houses (Lotus, AIG and other one - I forgot). By the time Indian investors get smart, we might have 100 fund houses in India, each having 10 equity funds - a grand total of 1000 funds to choose from. Most of these will be good funds because the new fund houses are professionally managed.
AMC corpus of your favorite fund house will definitely increase yes - but it won't be as much as you'd like it to be.
|
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 9:40pm
|
Good to see that Rel Cap is being discussed deeply.Thanks Basantji for your contribution.I think it would be very difficult to replace Rel MF from the top spot.The difference between Rel MF and ICICI Pru is 10,000crs which is huge.And with Natural Resources Fund they are expecting 3000-4000crs from it.SIP of 100 should also progressively contribute to the AUM.Whats more Reliance name is attached to it. ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 9:45pm
|
Smartcat,the market is big..once again posting what Madhu said in ET:
Considering the fact that the domestic equity holdings as a part of total savings is currently about 2%, we strongly believe that over the next five years, it could easily move to 5%. In other words, it would mean an additional investment of more than Rs 3 lakh crore. This however assumes that the current economic environment will continue. ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 9:54pm
|
Reliance Growth fund and Reliance Vision fund have become brands in their own ways. As a MF distributor I have absolutely no problem in convincing people to invest in these two funds but the moment I put up something new there is a prolonged discussion and many a times it remains inconclusive!!! ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: smartcat
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 10:20pm
|
Basant - You might want to investigate Tata AMC - and see if it is owned by Tata Investments.
Yeah - I like Rel Cap too. But the AMC business is just the bread. Insurance business and consumer finance/brokerage business is like butter and jam!
|
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 10:41pm
|
yes, tata AMC is owed by Tata Investment.
http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=128 - http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=128 ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: Ajith
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 10:47pm
|
Reliance Capital seems a good bet in financial services.Ultimately,they may even float a bank if RBI gives in.
No doubt about it,the brand equity of Reliance Mutual Fund will enable it to grow much faster than the marketThe total corpus can even grow 6 times in 6 years if a hot trend emerges.Will that in itself boost Rel Cap valuations?It well might. ------------- Ajith |
Posted By: johnnybravo
Date Posted: 13/Jun/2007 at 11:19am
Smartcat, What I am trying to say here is: 1) Irrespective of whether people become choosy/wiser about their investment, the bottom line is they will keep on investing more and that's what matters when we invest in an AMC. 2) Saturation-Competition is always followed by Mergers...The weaker players shall get out or merge funds but again irrespective of that people shall continue investing in MFs. A lot of MFs that existed a few years back have merged with some other strong handed ones. The whole idea here is that at a rising economy with increasing income levels, public participation shall increase multi fold and that's where the call is. Having said all this please rest assured, Reliance MF is not my favorite fund house, neither am I holding any MF from their kitty. For me the word 'Reliance' is 'High unreliable fellows'. Cheers! |
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 08/Jul/2007 at 11:36am
|
Equity fund inflows may dip 30% in July. (BS)
Rel MF's official denied rejecting any apllications. "We are accepting applications without the PAN or application form copy.However we will not allocate the units of the scheme to those investors who do not give us the PAN card copy or evidence of having applied for it before the allotment date" an official stressed.
A few fund distributors pointed out that Rel MF was also distributing PAN application forms along with the MF application forms.
Reliance Equity Advantage Fund aims to garner Rs.30-40 billion, which will close on July 10.
--------------------------------------------------
Basantji,your reply to the same.... ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: xbox
Date Posted: 08/Jul/2007 at 11:42am
|
We are trying to compare apple with oranges. Whole logic of investing in mutual funds is to gain diversification, low risk/reward kind of scenario. Investing directly in stock (could be any one) is for concentration, high risk/reward scenario.
Either of these hardly replaces each other in any investment zone as both are king of their own world.
<<Chota muh aur baddi baat>> ------------- Don't bet on pig after all bull & bear in circle. |
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 09/Jul/2007 at 12:30pm
That should put some more money in the market. Good for existing investors.
------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 10/Jul/2007 at 10:29pm
Reliance Growth Fund's AUM crosses $1 billion 
As i said earlier, i will always be biased towards this Fund...
I expect Rel MF AUM for July to be around Rs.62,000 crores...
Rel MF is awaiting SEBI approval for its overseas fund.. ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 15/Jul/2007 at 10:39am
|
Reliance MF has raised Rs.2500 crore from its Equity Advantage Fund. ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 15/Jul/2007 at 10:44am
|
That is lower as per their expectations. Initial estimates were at Rs 3000 crores+. ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: CHINKI
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 11:33pm
|
Reliance Equity Advantage Fund NFO collects Rs2,700 cr
Reliance Mutual Fund has the highest asset under managment (AUM) among all the Indian mutual fund houses with 32.8 lakh investors Mumbai: Anil Ambani Group firm, Reliance Mutual Fund has collected Rs2,700 crore through its new scheme, Reliance Equity Advantage Fund. “The new fund offer (NFO) collected over Rs2,700 crore with over 5.3 lakh applications coming in from over 325 cities and towns across the country,” a company release said here on 24 July. “This is further affirmation of the strength of the Reliance brand name and of the immense confidence that it enjoys among investors across the country,” Reliance Mutual Fund’s President Vikrant Gugnani said. Gugnani attributed the success of the NFO to Reliance Mutual Fund’s strategy of rapidly expanding retail presence across markets where it had not earlier been present. Reliance Mutual Fund has the highest asset under managment (AUM) among all the Indian mutual fund houses, as on 30 June its AUM was over Rs59,857 crore and had 32.8 lakh investors. SOURCE : http://www.livemint.com/2007/07/24151748/Reliance-Equity-Advantage-Fund.html - LIVEMINT ------------- TOUGH TIMES NEVER LAST, BUT TOUGH PEOPLE DO |
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 11:55pm
|
So some more money to be deployed in the markets - Is everyone still waiting for that BIG correction? ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: CHINKI
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 12:04pm
|
In his latest interview, Mr. Madhusudhan Kela of Reliance MF was mentioning that they are mainting lot of cash in many of their funds.
Looks like everybody wants SENSEX to fall. But it is not.  ------------- TOUGH TIMES NEVER LAST, BUT TOUGH PEOPLE DO |
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 12:08pm
|
Kela slipped miserably in June 2006 when his flagship Reliance Growth fund held more then 15% of its corpus in cash at the market lows. ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: Rinku
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 12:28pm
|
I am holding some cash and waiting for some correction..... |
Posted By: PrashantS
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 12:52pm
| well it is going to happen in friday...the start of a big correction...and my sense is that it will drift all the way to 13500 levels ....but i am no astrologer ...wait and watch.. |
Posted By: India_Bull
Date Posted: 24/Jul/2007 at 1:42am
|
Prashantjee, Kyon dara rahe ho bhai !!
Over the years I have learnt that Market doesnt do what everyone wants it to do !!!(so it will not fall that badly if at all it has to fall -15k level is good for consolidation , but who knows !!!
Well I have two fathers (one tech and one funda),
My tech father says jab Market badh rah hai to aur kharido aur gir raha hai to Becho..
My Funda father says hold on my dear son, you have long way to go !!
------------- India_Bull forever Bull ! www.kapilcomedynights.com |
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 22/Aug/2007 at 10:41am
|
According to sources Reliance Mutual Fund is planning to launch new funds worth Rs 8,000-Rs 12,000 crore soon. These New Fund Offerings (NFO) are likely to be close-ended funds for long-term capital appreciation. Reliance Mutual Fund also wants to increase Assets Under Management to Rs 85,000 crore by year-end which are Rs 65,000 crore as on August 1. (NDTV Profit) ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: CHINKI
Date Posted: 18/Dec/2007 at 11:44am
|
Basanthji, small correction in the thread title :
Now it is, Reliance MF - Stock is better then the Fund But it should be Reliance MF - Stock is better than the Fund. ------------- TOUGH TIMES NEVER LAST, BUT TOUGH PEOPLE DO |
Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 19/Dec/2007 at 12:56pm
|
That does not seem to be different! Or was it a typo. ------------- 'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in |
Posted By: CHINKI
Date Posted: 19/Dec/2007 at 1:00pm
I have highlighted the difference in colour. ------------- TOUGH TIMES NEVER LAST, BUT TOUGH PEOPLE DO |
Posted By: deveshkayal
Date Posted: 05/Feb/2008 at 9:44am
|
Reliance http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/india/reliance-bags-fund-of-the-year-award_10016391.html# - - Fund bagged Fund of the Year award in the equity category in the fifth ICRA Mutual Fund Awards 2008 held in Mumbai Tuesday.
Reliance Mutual fund also picked up six awards in other categories. Its four schemes bagged five-star and two schemes seven-star honours. ------------- "You don't need to be a rocket scientist. Investing is not a game where the guy with the 160 IQ beat the guy with a 130 IQ. Rationality is essential"- Warren Buffett |
Posted By: kulman
Date Posted: 08/Feb/2008 at 10:39pm
Source: http://www.livemint.com/2008/02/08171102/MF-assets-resilient-to-Jan-mar.html - MF assets resilient to Jan market crash: Crisil
------------- Life can only be understood backwards—but it must be lived forwards |
Posted By: joslinjose9
Date Posted: 15/Oct/2008 at 1:03pm
|
helo basanthji
can u suggest me some funds which i want to invest through sip way for a time horizon of 10 years which can deliver 20% returns.
------------- fear of lord is the beginning of wisdom |
Posted By: omshivaya
Date Posted: 15/Oct/2008 at 1:21pm
|
HDFC Prudence, SBI Magnum Contra and Reliance Vision are some good obes Joslin jee. ------------- The most important quality for an investor is temperament,not intellect.A temperament that neither derives great pleasure from being with the crowd nor against it |
Posted By: joslinjose9
Date Posted: 15/Oct/2008 at 1:27pm
|
thanks om for ur suggestion.do u think it is good to invest through sip.do u have any idea abt reliance equity fund growth ------------- fear of lord is the beginning of wisdom |
Posted By: joslinjose9
Date Posted: 05/Apr/2009 at 5:14pm
|
hi everybody,
the strategy of investing in mutual funds by systematic investment planning is very good.lets take an example.
if we had invested rs 5000 every month in reliance growth fund in april1999 to april 2009 our total investment will be 6 lakhs.
our total networth will now be 30 lakhs.
this is a very good return.
but our networth in jan 2008 was 60lakhs.
expect ur valuable advice about this.
------------- fear of lord is the beginning of wisdom |
Posted By: KACHAM
Date Posted: 10/Apr/2009 at 7:47am
|
I agree and we are planning a SIP with Reliance Vision/Growth MF ..
Hope I get the kind of returns you mentioned ------------- Jai Telangana, Jai Jai Telangana |