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Trading Psychology
 The Equity Desk Forum :Market Strategies :Trading Psychology
Message Icon Topic: Who wants to be a Mungerilal? Post Reply Post New Topic
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kulman
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Quote kulman Replybullet Posted: 20/Sep/2006 at 3:58pm
No wonder Buffet says in one of his letters to the shareholders:
"....Their interest in such matters is understandable, since techniques shrouded in mystery clearly have value to the purveyor of investment advice. After all, what witch doctor has ever achieved fame and fortune by simply advising 'Take two aspirins'?"
Life can only be understood backwards—but it must be lived forwards
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monu_duggad
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Quote monu_duggad Replybullet Posted: 20/Sep/2006 at 4:13pm
Thanks bubble...my guess about positive man was correct....but from what i heard from a friend....positive structure was a guest lecturer at Noorsie Moonji recently for a lecture on technical analysis...apparently he had gone broke and then resurrected himself and now owns a merc..
 
One more thing...a peculiar thing which i observed is...whenever it comes to disclosures on cnbc....most of them say...."I dont have any personal positions...clients might be holding ".....if they are sure of there views on investing and trading...why dont they hold personal positions ;-)
If you think you can,You Can
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basant
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Quote basant Replybullet Posted: 20/Sep/2006 at 4:25pm
That means that you need not trade and invest to buy a merc the market has other options in which people can make money.But it is a zero sum game someone's income is someone's expense (loss0.
 
Ambarish Baliga of Karvy, Darshan Mehta are two names who I have never heard of holding personal positions. As Jesse Livermore said "unless you bet you can never tell".
Of late AMbarish seeme to be holding MRO Tek so that means that he is not prohibited from holding stocks.When you look at this information in perspective that he is on air 5 times a week to tell you what to do and what not do the whole event looks bizzare.
 
 
'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in
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BubbleVision
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Quote BubbleVision Replybullet Posted: 20/Sep/2006 at 5:23pm
I currently dont have MSTA but i am a doing CMT (level 2).. Details can be found out from www.mta.org
You can't make money if you are unwilling to lose...It's like willing to breathe in but not willing to breathe out. -- ED SEYKOTA ....Read Disclaimer!
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Quote kulman Replybullet Posted: 23/Sep/2006 at 4:23pm

MUNGERILAL & CIRCUIT

 

Venue: Dealing room of brokerage “Gabbar Stockbrokers Security Advisors & Wealth Creators Pvt Ltd

 
Cast:1. Mungerilal--Our good old investor-cum-trader-cum-punter

        2. Circuit--the dealer, who punches orders at the speed of light

        3. Mob involving other traders, couple of more dealers

 

Time: 9:45AM

Day: Listing of RPL shares

 
Scene 1, Take 1...ACTION
 

Mungerilal: Good morning Circuit, kya haal hain?

Circuit: Morning Sir Jee (most of the Circuits in the industry call most of the Mungerilals, Sir Jee)

M: Kya lagta hain?

C: Aaj to gap se khulega, Japan, Korea dekho…kal Dow, Bovespa bhi strong tha. Aur RPL ka listing hain…

M: Arey yaar, maine 3 alag demat account se apply kiya tha lekin nahin mila.

C: Kya baat karte ho, Sir Jee? Apne almost sabhi clients ko RPL allotment aaya, demat mein bhi credit hua.

M: Hmmmm……. (cursing his luck). Kite pe khulega…RPL?

C: dekho, boss-log (?) to kehte hain 100 se jyada…Long term ke liye bahut achhaa hain. RPL 120 to aaj-kal mein dikhayega, Sir Jee. Kuchh naya plant aa raha hain Gujrat mein. Aur 82 pe bahut strong buying aayegi…

M: haan haan, world’s largest refinery hain, heavy & sour crude oil can be refined…Nelson index…. (as usual he has little knowledge of everything....…but now getting more concerned that he does not have allotment and it’s going to run away)

 
C: Bolo Sir Jee, market khulne ka samay ho gaya….order daalna hain? Jaldi bolo….aur bhi bahut orders hain…(simultaneously answering phone calls)

M: Opening dekho, phir dalna

Market opens…strong on global cues & euphoria….Mungerilal getting impatient….

 
M: Arey Circuit, yeh to bhage jaa raha hain…kya karoo?

C: thoda sa profit booking aayega…neeche laga do buy order…bolo Sir Jee…

M: Lagao 1000 shares 95.15, buy order!

C: Confirm 95.15, buy order RPL quantity 1000? OK Sir jee?

M: Daal do jaldi…(he is too excited)

C: Order daal diya ….yeh dekho exchange confirmation aa gaya!

 
The order gets executed in no time…. CNBC is beaming live pictures of RPL’s listing ceremony….
 

C: Aa gaya Sir Jee…Kya karna hain, intra-day nikalna hain?....

M: Aisa karo Circuit, 500 bechne rakho….aaj ka high kitna tha?

C: 105 tha, bolo kya karoon?

M: order daalo 500 sell 104.95, aur balance 500 daalo 109.45

C: Bechne ke liye rakh diya hain….Lagta hain bahut momentum hain aaj market mein…FII net buyers kal bhi!…

 
Stock corrects….downwards touches a low of 85 odd….Circuit is constantly on the phone…

M: Neeche buying support aa raha hain kya? Arey baap re, kitna volume hua thodi der mein!

C: Sir jee, Ambani group ka stock hain…operators neeche nahin girne dega…

 
Stock is volatile, in the background some traders shout with excitement after making some quick buck on RPL/other shares…making our Mungerilal further nervous. Constantly ringing phones…general euphoric atmosphere adds fuel to the fire…
 

M: Support le raha hain shaayad…85 ka…(talking to himself, but loudly)

C: Average karna hain kya…Sir Jee…aap ke demat mein to blue-chip shares hain…margin hain….khelna hain aur?

M: aur 1000 buy karo…86.25

C: punches the order in….pending hain

 
Within 10-15 minutes this order also gets executed…Mungerilal borrows a calculator from another dealer…makes some calculations….

M: apna do sell order cancel karo…phir se fresh daalo… 1000 @ 99.80 aur balance 1000 @ 104.95

C: punches the orders in….Orders pending hain…Sir Jee!

 

At the end of the day..the stock does not reach Mungerilal’s sell levels. He takes prompt delivery, thinks to himself, “thoda profit booking kiya IPO waalon ne…Tomorrow I will do BTST”.

 

The next day…he asks Circuit again to punch orders to sell 1000 @ 97.95 and 1000 @ 101.75…the rest is history…..He had to liquidate RPL at huge loss. Also to meet margin calls on his other leveraged trades Gabbar Stockbrokers Security Advisors & Wealth Creators Pvt Ltd sells his other blocked shares during the market crash when exchange was closed for 1 hour.

 

P.S.: The scene is not very different even today; Gabbar, Circuit are the same…only Mungerilal’s role is being played by newer actors.

 

Disclaimer: The characters depicted here are not meant for hurting anyone’s feelings, living or dead. This is a true story, with name of the characters changed to protect their real identity. Please read this & react keeping in mind that it is being narrated with a purpose of investor education.



Edited by kulman - 23/Sep/2006 at 4:39pm
Life can only be understood backwards—but it must be lived forwards
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BubbleVision
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Quote BubbleVision Replybullet Posted: 23/Sep/2006 at 4:32pm
great .... very Well written Kulman and absolutely TRUE...One statement says it all "….khelna hain aur?" trading to play and NOT to win......
You can't make money if you are unwilling to lose...It's like willing to breathe in but not willing to breathe out. -- ED SEYKOTA ....Read Disclaimer!
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Quote Equity Buff Replybullet Posted: 23/Sep/2006 at 4:45pm
 
Dear Kulman,
 
Well written "Sir Jee" !!
 
Rgds
Equity Buff
 
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kulman
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Quote kulman Replybullet Posted: 25/Sep/2006 at 11:40pm
 
 
The author says: ".....leverage -- the use of borrowed money or some other enhancer from the realm of financial engineering to increase the potential bang for your buck. As the hoariest of all the hoary adages on Wall Street states, leverage cuts both ways. Whatever tool you employ to heighten reward in an investment increases risk by the same amount."


Edited by kulman - 25/Sep/2006 at 11:40pm
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